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Poster: Cliff Hucker Date: Sep 10, 2010 8:13am
Forum: GratefulDead Subject: Re: Is there a 74 show you would NOT recommend ?

Nobody will ever convince me that the Europe '74 tour did not suck ass. With the exception of 9/10 and 9/18, one show is worse than the next. And nothing anyone else says will change that! 9/9 in particular, is a mailed in performance. Anyone know why the band was so late getting to the Alexandra Palace that night? That show sounds like a soundcheck!

I'm also not impressed with 5/12, in spite of the second set jams (yawn)...

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Poster: micah6vs8 Date: Sep 10, 2010 9:15am
Forum: GratefulDead Subject: Re: Is there a 74 show you would NOT recommend ?

I had DP7 ( 9 - 9,10,11 - 74 ) for a long time collecting dust . Tired and mostly lackluster playing .
Maybe a real come down from their last European tour , and memories of Pig ?

edit - and exhaustion ?

This post was modified by micah6vs8 on 2010-09-10 16:15:52

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Poster: Cliff Hucker Date: Sep 10, 2010 9:23am
Forum: GratefulDead Subject: Re: Is there a 74 show you would NOT recommend ?

Heroin (nee Persian), Cocaine, Heineken, Mouton Rothschild...

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Poster: stratocaster Date: Sep 10, 2010 2:50pm
Forum: GratefulDead Subject: Re: Is there a 74 show you would NOT recommend ?

check out the Dark Star > Morning Dew again, really great stuff there...haven't listened to the rest of the disks in a few...

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Poster: clementinescaboose Date: Sep 10, 2010 11:50am
Forum: GratefulDead Subject: Re: Is there a 74 show you would NOT recommend ?

i'd have to somewhat agree with that, micah. of what i've heard from that tour i really like the 18th but i don't spend much time listening to DP 7. the band just seems kinda ragged. i do, however, really like the Dark Star. some unique playing in that one.

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Poster: Mandojammer Date: Sep 10, 2010 8:50am
Forum: GratefulDead Subject: Re: Is there a 74 show you would NOT recommend ?

So, not to put words in Cliff's mouth,

but everything after 01 January 1974.....................?

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Poster: TOOTMO Date: Sep 10, 2010 12:51pm
Forum: GratefulDead Subject: Re: Is there a 74 show you would NOT recommend ?

"Nobody will ever convince me that the Europe '74 tour did not suck ass."
I don't think ANYBODY could ever convince you of ANYTHING. Hell, Cliff, you couldn't even convince yourself to stop going to shows that sucked (in your opinion).

Enjoy,
TOOTMO

http://www.archive.org/details/gd1969-01-26.sbd.miller.109642.flac16

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Poster: Arbuthnot Date: Sep 10, 2010 4:04pm
Forum: GratefulDead Subject: Re: Is there a 74 show you would NOT recommend ?

i'm not about to dig through the Cliff archive, but i seem to recall that while he may have attended shows in the '80s that didn't exactly thrill him (i don't know any GD show goers who hadn't experienced the same, including myself), he never stated that the shows sucked at the time; in retrospect he wish he hadn't wasted so much money, but i'm fairly certain that at the time, he largely enjoyed the shows; if my recollection is athwart the truth, i'm sure Cliff will let me know

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Poster: TOOTMO Date: Sep 10, 2010 4:24pm
Forum: GratefulDead Subject: Re: Is there a 74 show you would NOT recommend ?

Methinks, you are being mighty generous. I, too, do not have time to dig through the Clifffiles but I have never gotten the impression that it was only hindsight that made Dennis feel that way about 80's show---but perhaps I am mistaken.

TOOTMO

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Poster: Cliff Hucker Date: Sep 10, 2010 4:44pm
Forum: GratefulDead Subject: Re: Is there a 74 show you would NOT recommend ?

"perhaps I am mistaken?"

Indeed you are!

I did enjoy attending performances during the late 70's and 80's. Otherwise I would not have wasted so much time and money touring.

It's only now, with thousands of hours of amazing music available here from 1966-1977, that I have come to realize just how shitty all those 80's shows were...

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Poster: TOOTMO Date: Sep 10, 2010 7:19pm
Forum: GratefulDead Subject: Re: Is there a 74 show you would NOT recommend ?

Well, then I stand corrected. (Which I am glad to be b/c that would have made you a very strange fella indeed.)

BUT, I will say you have been one cranky sonofabitch since about this time last year when you started "forsakin'
the partakin'".

Everybody have a lovely weekend,
TOOTMO

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Poster: Cliff Hucker Date: Sep 10, 2010 7:32pm
Forum: GratefulDead Subject: Re: Is there a 74 show you would NOT recommend ?

Well you are right about that...

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Poster: midnightcarousel Date: Sep 10, 2010 2:03pm
Forum: GratefulDead Subject: Re: Is there a 74 show you would NOT recommend ?

zing!

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Poster: elbow1126 Date: Sep 10, 2010 4:32pm
Forum: GratefulDead Subject: Re: Is there a 74 show you would NOT recommend ?

I don't think 9-21 sucks. Not as good as 9-18 but definitely better than 9-20.

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Poster: Cliff Hucker Date: Sep 10, 2010 4:57pm
Forum: GratefulDead Subject: Re: Is there a 74 show you would NOT recommend ?

I have actually tried, on two separate occasions over the past couple of months, to review the entire '74 Europe tour. This, after spending two months listening to little other than shows from the Europe '72 tour. Both times I have struggled to make it through each show in succession. The shows are just not very good and the playing is generally rather poor.

Sure, there are some compelling passages in a few of the performances. For instance the Playin'> Drums> Playin' from 9/21 that you pointed out. And the somewhat unique performance of Eyes of the World from 9/11. Still these segments are not enough to carry those shows.

With the exception of 9/10 and 9/18, these shows warrant scores in the mid 80's to lower 90's. 9/9 in particular is a very poor performance and 9/14 and 9/20 should score out no higher than 86 pts. So spending a lot of time with this tour is like drinking Yellowtail when you could be enjoying Chateau Petrus...

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Poster: elbow1126 Date: Sep 10, 2010 7:14pm
Forum: GratefulDead Subject: Re: Is there a 74 show you would NOT recommend ?

Thats true, i was sipping some of that '74 Petrus in the form of this show the other night.

http://www.archive.org/details/gd74-02-24.sbd.windsor.199.sbefail.shnf

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Poster: leftwinger57 Date: Sep 11, 2010 11:32am
Forum: GratefulDead Subject: Re: Is there a 74 show you would NOT recommend ?

Sorry for not knowing dates but I clearly remember that before the first hiatis things sounded horrible. I was at winterland for what was stamped on the ticket THE LAST ONE. If memory serves me that show was ok even good but nothing like the closing of winterland 4years later.

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Poster: elbow1126 Date: Sep 11, 2010 12:20pm
Forum: GratefulDead Subject: Re: Is there a 74 show you would NOT recommend ?

Here is the info from the last show before the break. Since this ha been commercially released you can't listen to the sbd here.

http://www.archive.org/details/gd1974-10-20.sbd.alligator.GEMS.94851.flac16

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Poster: cousinkix1953 Date: Sep 12, 2010 3:45am
Forum: GratefulDead Subject: Re: Is there a 74 show you would NOT recommend ?

Try this one instead...

http://www.archive.org/details/gd1974-10-20.sbd.smith-lee.GEMS.97193.flac16

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Poster: whirlwind dreamer 65-95 Date: Sep 12, 2010 4:45am
Forum: GratefulDead Subject: Re: Is there a 74 show you would NOT recommend ?

i didnt know they played a good lovin in 74" i'll have to check that out.

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Poster: elbow1126 Date: Sep 12, 2010 4:04am
Forum: GratefulDead Subject: Re: Is there a 74 show you would NOT recommend ?

Quite interesting. Thanks!

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Poster: Dudley Dead Date: Sep 10, 2010 6:04pm
Forum: GratefulDead Subject: Re: Is there a 74 show you would NOT recommend ?

I like the Europe, and the Winterland run more than some of you I guess ( and the Winterland more that the Europe ), but I think you are correct that there was a falloff , compared with the earlier part of the year when the whole shows had a little more going for them . To me the jams are fine, but the standard sort of songs seem a little tired in execution . I would think this would be especially evident after listening to all those Europe 72 shows, were the most common 1st set song is mostly great .I know there were all sorts of problems, in this period coke, personal , financial ( by the way, I thought Garcia was exposed to Persian in the "time off" period ? But I just don't know ).I still think 74 was one of their best years, but
maybe it was a good time to take a break .

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